Yogurt

I didn't want to make a big deal about it, because it really isn't. It is not as if I would close the thread or anything. The main thing is that personal likes and dislikes about food are so subjective that I am not sure how it all relates. You could be talking about bread, or wheatgrass juice, or any number of things.

Sure, I get how the yogurt thing relates and how different brands have different probiotic offerings, but it really is not like comparing concentrated probiotics, particularly those that have been studied. Plus, even with those, you cannot tell how it may or may not improve your function until after you have taken it for months. And, even with those, it is individual.

I don't know if it is the probiotics in yogurt or just the general digestibility of it that makes it a very friendly food for the gut (except for those who are not tolerant of milk or allergic), but I think the consensus is that you need to consume it at least daily for any specific benefit other than the nutritive value. Many of the commercial yogurts don't have enough live active cultures to make any difference at all, and it is not even known if those strains survive the stomach acid.

Jan

quote:

Plus, even with those, you cannot tell how it may or may not improve your function until after you have taken it for months. And, even with those, it is individual.

Some of the same things are said in the various probiotic threads. In fact, I see a discussion of name brands and prices coursing through those threads, yet nobody is saying they got "off track" because it was not being tied in with pouch function. I just read a probiotic thread in which one poster basically said it either works or it doesn't, and it is totally individual, and the live bacteria counts don't matter necessarily. So then nobody should start any threads on yogurts or probiotics because there is no general applicability to what anyone says as to pouch function and the only real consistently applicable info we glean are the things discussed in this thread: price, quality, cost, taste, etc. At least I have given descriptions of why I liked or did not like the taste of certain yogurts, which would enable others to maybe gauge whether it is worth the try.

But despite such uncertainties, most of us take probiotics and most of us eat yogurt, on the theory, for which nobody has any solid empirical evidence even in their own individual case, that it enhances our intestinal health in some way.

Now one thing I do want to talk about that is pertinent to pouch function is that I bought something called So Delicious Cultured Coconut Milk (Strawberry Flavor) which has both prebiotics and probiotics in it. And from what I understand prebiotics are indigestible ingredients that somehow stimulate bacterial growth. And what I am wondering is whether they would be more or less beneficial than probiotics to someone taking antibiotics?

By the ways, the strawberry tastes much better than the plain flavor!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It is not sour like the plain nor is it overly sweet and tastes like it has real fruit in it (which, apparently, it does).

This thread, in my opinion, has become so disrespectful to the forum moderator. I think it was clearly stated that the discussion should be discontinued. The fact that it keeps perpetuating makes me think that some people are more concerned with voicing their opinions than they are with following directions.

Sue

I don't see anything wrong with this thread. Seems to be just attacking in general. Some valid questions and points are made with opinions.

Do some people just not like DJBHusky ? Can't we just be adults.

No, no; I never meant the discussion should be discontinued. Lots of topics go a little sideways from time to time. It's OK if they do. So, let's not let this get weird.

Interesting question about prebiotics. Lactulose is considered to be a prebiotic, and that is one of Dr. Shen's favorite treatments for chronic pouchitis. However, I don't know if the amount in yogurt would be therapeutic. I know Culturelle includes the prebiotic inulin.

Jan

Jan, Kathy & Suebear,

I think all 3 of you are the best and have helped me more times than I can remember.

I am in no way disrespecting you Jan. I am so sorry my post sounded like that. I was voicing my opinion about how the thread has helped me, that is all.

I have a VSL#3DS problem and am going to start a new thread.

quote:

This thread, in my opinion, has become so disrespectful to the forum moderator. I think it was clearly stated that the discussion should be discontinued. The fact that it keeps perpetuating makes me think that some people are more concerned with voicing their opinions than they are with following directions.

What are you talking about??????????????? Threads are to be discontinued because they contain certain opinions???? Nobody has indicated that anything should be discontinued and nobody has disrespected anyone. It sounds to me like a few posters (I am guessing 2, including you) have prodded Jan to try and stop "blog like comments". I have no personal blog here, but if I did it is no different than some of the probiotic threads which contain similar commentary. All that is contained in the thread is information that can be used, or not. If you don't want to use it, do not read it. You don't have to read it, it's that simple. Others have already said they do not understand what the problem is - nor do I.

You have already indicated your political agenda earlier in the thread. Some do not share it and you should not be imposing your political views on others. This thread when I started it did not call for any political commentary on from whom yogurt should or should not be purchased, and you were the only person to make comments in that regard. It is very surprising that Kathy Smith, who has a history of complaining when political commentary is made on this board, has not sent a missive to Jan about your political statements in this thread. Maybe you should apply what you say to your own posts which frankly are the only ones in this thread that are against board rules and policy as I know them to be. To me, anyone who reads this thread will see that the only person who has disrespected board policy (and the Moderator by extension of that), is you for making political comments along the lines of where or from whom yogurt should not be purchased.

quote:

Do some people just not like DJBHusky ?

Bingo!

OK, one more try, because now it is getting wierd:

Let's have no more calling out individuals (don't care which side you are on). Either drop it, or the thread will be closed. If you have a personal beef, send a PM to the person.

Stay on topic- yogurt and what it does for you.

Jan

Thank you for the kind words toughenough. You have also offered a boatload of helpful information and support to people here. Thank YOU for sticking around and helping others.

Jan - as always - thank you for being the voice of reason.

kathy

quote:

Stay on topic- yogurt and what it does for you.

I just have one question about this. You yourself have stated that you don't know what the benefit of yogurt is to you. Neither do I, except generally on a theoretical level. I think that is the case with most of us.

However, I want to make sure it is okay to be posting about yogurt absent some scientific empirical evidence in my case, which would be an impossibility to do. I intend to research further this weekend and post about yogurts with prebiotics, based on Vanessavy's recent post indicating Dr. Shen believes lactulose and other prebiotics are an effective treatment in preempting pouchitis. In doing that research, I plan to identify what yogurts have prebiotics, what the prebiotics are, what amounts of prebiotics, how they taste and what they cost, at least comparatively adjusting for regional differences. To me, this information could be valuable to some. I will have no empirical evidence to post about what it does for me, other than Dr. Shen apparently believing it is good for me (and other pouchitis patients). That's good enough for me. I don't believe I should need to post anything additional as far as that goes.

Furthermore, it may be over the course of time that a pattern will develop, especially as my anticipated regimen of antibiotics one week and no antibiotics the next comes to fruition. To make that treatment regimen work, I am going to need to have everything I can get as far as probiotics and prebiotics. That is why this thread became important to me and I said that at the outset. I don't understand why the other stuff should be ignored. It is all information, and this board is supposed to be about information, I thought. I just want to be clear on what the expectation should be in this regard. Thanks.

I might also do the same thing for yogurts with probiotics. I believe, however, that brand names, taste (if at least described why it is good or bad, which I have done), cost and supplier information are all information that should be posted. People are free to use it or not. It may be beneficial and someone may be able to understand on their own what the likely comparative costs are adjusting for regional differences in cost of living. I think it can be figured out that if one yogurt costs more than another in Connecticut, it will cost more than another in California, Australia or Canada as well.

All sounds good to me. I look forward to your report. If you have time, some yogurt brands have information on their web sites about the cultures in their yogurt and purported benefits. Some even have some studies. I hink Activia does (at leadt they claim to intheir ads). Yakult is another one I believe has health benefit claims.

Jan

(But, please, no more references to the Third Reich...that stung me a bit, even if it was a joke!)

quote:

no more references to the Third Reich

That reference was not directed at you personally but to the two individuals whom I suspected complained to you by PM that this thread was becoming a personal blog, and whom I suspect have some level of interest or investment in the management of this board based on their past posting histories. That of course is irrelevant speculation, but I mention it only so that you know it was directed at them and not you. I am sorry about the reference in any event, but I was completely reduced to shock and incredulity by the post that prompted it (which was not yours, if you go back and read my post). I don't think I was ever more shocked by anything I have read on this board, but I would say it is time to move on from this discussion and I will. I will also try to be attentive to factoring in answers to some of the issues you mentioned.

OK, just understand, when a comment is directed toward the moderation, it is a safe assumption it would be Bill J (who had not commented) or myself, the only people with moderating capabilities. The other moderator, Dave H, is deceased, and definitely not commenting. That is why I took it personally.

Matter considered settled, so on to yogurt!

Jan

Here is the nutritional information on the So Delicious Prebiotic/Probiotic Cultured Strawberry Flavored Coconut Milk:

http://www.sodeliciousdairyfre...erry-yogurt-beverage

The prebiotic in this yogurt beverage is inulin, from chicory root extract. I can't seem to find any information either on the bottle or the SD website on how much of this prebiotic I am getting in a typical serving.

Good question.

Well, there is 2gm of dietary fiber in the bottle, and that includes the inulin, the pectin, and the strawberries. So, probably not much inulin. But, how much is necessary? I don't know. Even the Culturelle Digestive Health probiotic that contains inulin, does not say how much it has.

The house brand probiotic smoothie I've been buying lately, (Sunnyside), also has inulin in it and has 5Gm of dietary fiber.
http://www.fatsecret.com/Diary...?pa=fjrd&rid=2057506

Jan

Post update: for those interested, here is a link to a good article explaining probiotics and prebiotics, and their use in IBD. It is a little old (2008), so the data is not fresh. But, the best comprehensive review I've seen.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2291386/

That Sunnyside house brand seems like it has more prebiotics in it. I should have mentioned that I experienced some mild gas drinking the So Delicious Cultured Coconut Milk. I have read that any product containing inulin can be expected to cause some level of gas. In my case it was mild.

The only concern I would have about the coconut drink, is that it has no protein, all fat and carb calories. Not good from a diabetes standpoint. But, if you need dairy free, it has that going for it.

Jan

I was off today and went shopping this morning. I bought the following two Probiotic Yogurt beverages, which I thought would be a good comparison because they are about the same in price:

Organic Valley Lowfat Yogurt Smoothie (Triple Berry Flavor). Nutritional information:

http://www.organicvalley.coop/products/yogurt/berry/

Lifeway Kefir Lowfat Cultured Milk Smoothie (Mango Flavor). Nutritional information:

http://lifeway.net/Products/Ke...fir/LowFatMango.aspx

The Organic Valley product claims 320 billion live and active probiotics. The Kefir product claims 10 plus 2 live and active kefir cultures (7 to 10 billion).

I tried both. I personally thought that the Organic Valley product tasted a little bit better but there was no significant difference in taste.

It should be noted that the Organic Valley product contains organic inulin (prebiotic) but only 1 g of dietary fiber so this seems to be a negligible quantity as compared with Jan's Sunnyside smoothie. The Kefir appears to have no prebiotics or dietary fiber, but it is 99% lactose free.

It seem like Organic Valley has more probiotics, 320 billion to 10 billion. It seems Organic Valley gives me more prebiotics for my buck, albeit in a negligle quantity.

I am kind of wondering how it is that these two products were the same price.

quote:

Yes, KangaRoe, I think those sorts of comments make sense and can be helpful. Some brands seem to be more useful to pouchers than others, although I am not sure why.

I should have expaanded my post. I have had my pouch for 20 years and back then there was not as much information about pouches and what you should eat. I remember either the j-pouch surgeon or GI doc told me it would be good to eat yogurt. I aked him why and he said it has probiotics in it which is good for the intestines and keep the bad bacteria in check. I think that is what he said, it was so long ago. I asked him which ones do you think are good and he gave me a few but Stonyfield was the one that I liked the best. I have been eating it and have been a fan of that particular yogurt for years.

Now many years later there are many good yogurts (with a good mix of probiotics) and tasty ones to choose. There are a couple of strains of probiotic the doc said to make sure were in the yogurt but I can't remember which ones to be exact.

KanagaRoe

I bought some single serving probiotic yogurt smoothies. The following 2 products were about the same in price, adjusting for quantity of product:

Stonyfield Organic Super Smoothie, 10 ounces, Vanilla flavor. Nutritional information:

http://www.stonyfield.com/prod...-smoothies/vanilla-0 (click on "Get Nutrtion Facts")

Dahlicious Lassi Probiotic Indian Style Yogurt Drink, 7 ounces, Ecuadorian Banana Flavor. Nutritional information:

http://www.dahlicious.com/Flavors.htm

The Dahlicious Lassi has 15 billion live probiotics. This product markets itself as "the world's first smoothie", born in the Himalayas 4,000 years ago.

The Stoneyfield smoothie, from what I can read, provides information on the types of probiotic but not the total live count, unless I am missing something. Like the Dahlicious Lassi, this product has no identifiable quantity of prebiotics (Lassi does offer 2g dietary fiber, Stoneyfield less than 1g).

I liked the taste of both of these smoothies. The Dahlicious Lassi is an Indian-style yogurt and has a slightly different texture which I would describe as more like the powdery texture of a protein shake. The Stonyfield had a more traditional smoothie texture. Both tasted good to me.

Here is another prebiotic and probiotic yogurt I tried this week, Maia, nutritional information here:

http://www.maiayogurt.com/nutrition.cfm

I tried the Greek variety which is pre-mixed, very thick and somewhat sour in taste.

I am 5 days into my "no antibiotic week" and seem to be doing okay so far eating lots of probiotic smoothies, yogurts and capsule supplements. Some mild spotting the last 2 nights, possibly due to what I ate via larger late dinners, but I feel pretty good so far. I resume antibiotics Monday as I continue my regimen of antibiotics one week, no antibiotics/high probiotics the next.

good sign DJBHusky... i hope your success with this regimen continues! u deserve it

btw, i tried the Liberte Mediterrannee coconut yogurt, and i liked it! it was sweet like having a dessert after dinner.

Have been absolutely fine with basic yoghurts with greek being my favorite. Decided to try symbio which has probotics......absolute disaster, output is just water again. Thinking back I tried yakault when I still had my colon and the same thing happend. So don't think that probotics are good for me.

Just an update on some additional products I tried:

Coach Farm Yo-Goat Cultured Goat Milk. Product description: http://www.coachfarmstore.com/yogoat-12-pa12.html This one tastes pretty good, can't really find any info on the amount of live cultures in it.

KeVita Sparkling Probiotic Coconut Water. Nutritional info: http://kevita.com/product-family/coconut/ This one actually is not a yogurt but rather sparkling probiotic coconut water. It's got an unusual taste but not bad. Main positive with this product is it is very low in calories as compared to the probiotic yogurt smoothies. Only 5 calories per 8 ounces of beverage. This one also has no information on the amount of live cultures.

Goodbelly Probiotic Coconut Water: http://www.goodbelly.com/probiotic-drink/quarts/ Another lower calorie alternative to traditional probiotic yogurt smoothies, this one tastes like a typical coconut water but to me had a slightly stronger taste than most coconut waters I have tried. I also bought the mango flavor, which I have not tried yet. 20 billion live cultures per 8 ounce serving.

CTBarrister, your information is valuable to me. In light of the fact that you are on antibiotics one week and then off, it is invaluable to you, and that is good information for all of us. Thank you for your many contributions and I am sorry you are having such difficulty. SallyJPouch

I just bought a brand new product called Dahlicious Aliv. It is a sugar free (i.e. "no sugar added" beyond what is in the strawberries), gluten free probiotic drink containing 50 billion probiotics in a 3.92 ounce bottle. 70 calories per serving. I could not find nutritional info online that I could post, but did find this on their Facebook page:

https://www.facebook.com/DAHli....Lassi/photos_stream

It comes in 3 varieties, "women's health", "immune health", and digestive health." 4 bottles per package.

I bought the strawberry flavored digestive health variety at Whole Foods Market. It has no added sugar or artificial sweeteners, so it is not sweet. Otherwise it has an average yogurt smoothie taste.