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I've lived here all my life, and my previous surgeon moved away, and unfortunately I am currently in need of one to address a situation that cannot wait. My pelvic cavity from when my jpouch was removed 2 years ago has never healed, and in recent months, has gotten so much worse, and needs to be addressed. It is a long, complicated, and pretty big surgery from what I hear (He recommended flap reconstruction-gracilis), and me not having my surgeon of over 20 yrs. anymore who knows my whole history, I feel so lost and its overwhelming just doing google searches and reading reviews of patients online of Atlanta colo-rectal surgeons and such different pros and cons in order to find a colo-rectal surgeon AND a plastic surgeon (potentially- if I go through with this option- which scares me to death researching it!)
Cleveland clinic was my first thought in my mission a month ago, but when I contacted my previous colo-rectal surgeon a month ago and we talked on the phone, (the one who moved away, and informed me of the flap reconstruction), he said I would need to find one here for the follow-up care-which makes sense-I can't be driving up to Cleveland every 2-3 weeks for check-up-doesn't sound practical. So how does practically everyone else as you mentioned manage that unless they all live in Cleveland??
May sound like a naive question, as I know Cleveland Clinic is the best of the best in colo-rectal care, but how does one manage all the follow-up care?

Anyhow, still not sure what to do, and need help fast.
I spent the day searching and searching throughout the different forums/posts that yielded info from others on perianal wounds that have not healed from jpouch removal/ flap reconstruction procedure (which is what my color-rectal recommended), and I went online to make an appt. with Dr. Remzi. But just concerned on how long that will take- I am in a lot of pain everyday, and have to hide it at work, and trying to push through my day teaching at school- 3 weeks of school left. My anus is sewn up, so it makes the pain worse, when you have pools of fluid infection inside (had to go to ER 2 weeks ago and they saw that in CT scan) that causes pain and such pressure and can't get out, except to leak through vaginally- its awful.

Anyhoo, I digress, but its difficult to take all the time/steps needed to make such a big decision and gather all the info/options and resolving the acquired inquiries that develop with the more knowledge gained, in order to make the best decision- when you just want it out and the pain to be relieved by any means asap.
But knowing you won't feel good about going forward with any procedure unless you feel good about your chosen colo-rectal- and the one I went to here last week in same practice was ok, but don't feel great about him.
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natalie-sorry to hear things have gone so awry for you. I have my jpouch removed over one year ago at Cleveland clinic by Dr. Remzi. And I too have an unhealed sinus tract and wound.. no fault of his. I know all too well about the pain, pressure, etc that you are dealing with.

I have spent well over one year trying to get the stupid wound to heal with countless EUA surgeries for incision and drainage, CT guided drainages, and now experimental injections via endoscopy by the infamous Dr. Shen to try to get scar tissue to form. Some success thus far,but possibly just opened another vaginal fistula. So for me, a gracilas flap repair is lingering if the experimental injections don't work all the way.

I know these unhealed wounds are very rare and also very difficult and frustrating for all the doctors involved. I do not live in Cleveland, though unlike you, I am within a reasonable driving distance. I transferred my care there after I had significant problems after my step 3 jpouch, ileostomy takedown and my local doctors threw darts aimlessly and seemed like they left me rotting to get sicker and sicker.

I do not understand why you were sewn up with an unhealed wound. That doesn't seem the way to go. My wound was left open so it could drain. I had hematomas and abscesses immediately after surgery.

It sounds like you have several things going on. First and foremost, that wound needs draining, asap. Seems like any colorectal surgeon should be able to do that. Why cannot your local hospital just have someone do that? Also I am wondering about infection/abscess. Is there an infectious disease doctor on your case?

for the long term solution, especially if gracilis flap repair is being discussed, I think you want the best colorectal surgeon you can find in the US along with a very experienced plastic surgeon. These surgeries are done in teams usually. Dr. Remzi at CC has already has a plastic surgeon involved in my case, and both are ready to pull the trigger and work together in the operating room if it comes down to a gracilis flap repair for me. And I like the plastic surgeon as much as I like Dr. Remzi.

Also, I believe infectious disease doctors are of value, as I think there is a component preventing healing.

I do not agree that you should focus on local doctors so you have after care. I think right now, you need help. Immediately, that area needs opening and draining. And then you need real experts to try to see if they can get the thing to heal..maybe without a gracilis flap. I have met with a plastic surgeon Dr. Remzi brought onto my case. I know it is a big big surgery, and right now, we are trying to do things to avoid that. But if it came to having to sign up for a gracilis flap, I think you would want the best of the best of the best doing that. It is a big surgery, and not just for the wound - as in my case - they would core open the sinus tract/wound even more, but now, other areas of your body are being compromised. Seriously, who would've ever thought you would have to lose a leg muscle because of ulcerative colitis!

so to reiterate.. maybe just take whatever colorectal guy you can get to asap in atlanta, have him do an EUA surgery just to get it opened and draining. That will buy you time to get to the real experts - if you can find them in atlanta, if not.. to get initial consultations scheduled at CC. I suspect Dr. R. wouldn't even be available to consult until july as he is out of country pretty much rest of may and surgeries booked for june already.

But regardless.. I just want to reiterate... I understand your situation, it is complicated, and the long term solution is NOT for the average doctor. I wouldn't worry about followup care locally, but rather the care you need to get things fixed.

PM me if you'd like and I'm happy to give you my phone number to chat more.
liz.
Last edited by liz11
There's a Mayo Clinic in Jacksonville, FL and a Cleveland Clinic somewhere in FL as well. I think Chuckus goes to Mayo in Jacksonville. You might want to PM him. Both are rated #1 and #2 in the country. I don't know if it's by location or entire program. Just an idea of a some place closer. It's a real delicate surgery. Maybe you can have it at one location and follow-up at another branch of the same hospital.
If this helps my daughter had 2nd worse case of uc in a Baltimore hospital that they had ever seen. Lost 55 lbs 22 blood transfusions - showed me the colored pix and said she had to have an ileostomy. (then j-pouch) One intern told her to save her rectum for various reasons - -as did her surgeon - that was 19 years ago - recently a lump developed -and she went to the Cleveland Clinic which is a 7 hour drive - have had scans, even a needle put in locally - just came back from DC hospital saying they can't figure it out - she has colon cancer but no colon - so she is going to see the Doctor who originally operated on her - he is 19 hours away now - The Dr who found the cancer, which even he can't believe is a colo-rectal specialist - NOT A GI - she is going to see the oncologist Wednesday who told her that she did not have cancer - I am just sick to my stomach seeing her go thru this all again -
Dot, I'm so sorry your daughter is going through all of this. If it's cancer or not it appears as she has a problem or a tumor of some kind. If she still has her rectum maybe it's in there. I just have 2 cm of my rectum left at my rectal stump, where the j-pouch is attached and I still get UC in that 2 cm and can still get cancer there. So if she still has her entire rectum it makes sense that she can get cancer in it. I always assumed the rectum was part of the colon as I always had UC in the top of it. I hope she gets so answers and a plan of action soon.
TE, thanks so much for your info. That is a good idea, and is closer as another option. I will definitely look into that too-on my research list!Smiler

It's truly day to day, and tonight seems to be a bad one (a bursting day), and from corresponding with Liz and reading from others on other posts, and all the research and ino gained from 2 drs i have sought out here (met with a colorectal last week and plastic surgeon 2weeks ago),that as much as the reconstruction surgery freaks me out right now, and may not be ready to jump into that, despite the amount of pain im having, I for now have decided that I do need to get it drained ASAP for some relief and open it up to see if any improvement. And meantime, continue to gain more info and plan on either staying or going Cleveland/Mayo for gracilis surgery.

In responding in another post, it inadvertently turned into my story in a Cliffs Notes version sort of way, but cathartic too a bit. And thought I would include it here as well, as it has been a long while since Ive been back on this site, and an effort to help/share with others. I originally reached out in a great need for help when things suddenly became their worst, but I have also been reminded of the incredible support/resources this group can bring and I quickly felt connected again and value the communication with others who can truly relate in so many similar ways-so thankful for that. Smiler Here I am below:


I had my jpouch created in 1990 (I was 12) and 6 months later, developed an abscess rectovaginal fistula. I had several little surgeries to heal fistula including a seton, fistulotomy that were unsuccessful, and finally temp. ileostomy to divert it in order to heal. I had developed a defect vaginally that still allowed drainage. In 1998, I had an advancement flap done as vaginal reconstruction to correct the defect, and then I no longer had drainage vaginally. In 2001, I decided to try again at reconnection of Jpouch in the hopes that it would work the second time. I had my temp. ileostomy taken down in 6/2001, and it went great, no drainage vaginally. However, 7 weeks later, I developed an abscess and rectovaginal fistula- again. I immediately went into surgery to drain abscess and I got another temp. ileostomy.


At this point, I was pretty heartbroken that it did not work and this complication occurred again. And I was in neutral mode for 10 years until I finally decided to make my temp. ostomy permanent in 2011. I was not up for trying to connect my jpouch again, and I wanted to have the better quality of life that my ostomy gave me. Plus the fact that having your jpouch in you being unused and dormant, causes it to get inflamed and causes pressure/pain which was increasing over time, as well as mucous drainage. And I wanted the pressure and leakage gone most importantly as well.

I had my jpouch removed June 2011 with permanent ileostomy. But unfortunately, a few weeks after my jpouch was removed, I began to have drainage vaginally. My anus was sewn up in my jpouch removal surgery, and it healed up very well, and did not cause me any pain. I also should add that my anus did not ever close completely; There is a tiny hole that did not ever close completely (even though my surgeon had said that eventually it would), drainage comes through there slightly too, but mostly vaginally. I did not have any pain/pressure from anus initially, as it wasn’t until about 6 months to a year later that the pressure began to increase to an uncomfortable state and the drainage has always been present. And then in January 2013, pressure began again in a more intense way and the drainage changed to a very foul smell- as this is usually a sign of infection when pressure increases and odor changes of drainage. As this has happened before, eventually subsides, I didn’t give much concern/attention to it. However, unlike in the past, it never died down again and near the end of this past March, it became much more intense and the drainage was the foulest odor ever- extremely strong.


In the past month, more symptoms have popped up that I haven’t had before like: random fevers, fatigue, intense pressure that comes and goes, and overall not feeling as well. But some days better than others.

I spoke with my previous colo-rectal surgeon who’s known me since I was 12, at the end of March when symptoms intensifed to a degree I've never felt. My previous colo-rectal surgeon has moved away, but we corresponded by phone/email when my symptoms began to worsen in March, and he suggested the flap reconstruction procedure (butt, leg, or abdomen) to heal the pelvic cavity, and that I needed to see a plastic surgeon for it and the procedure would be done along with a colo-rectal surgeon. I met with a plastic surgeon he recommended the gracilis flap and the surgey would be done along with a colo-rectal surgeon as well. So that is why my original post was in search of a great colo-rectal surgeon in Atlanta. Since then, I have seen another colo-rectal surgeon that is in the same practice as my old one; He is a great surgeon- not so great bedside manner, but difficult to have best of both. I really like my plastic surgeon- very skilled and knowledgeable and very personable as well. In the past 3 weeks I have had 2 appointments with each of them- one, to initially meet and discuss, and second one- to talk more in depth about my situation and answer more questions I have developed over the course of this month in learning and researching more information on this procedure.

And because I’ve had recto-vaginal fistulas on both attempts to reconnect jpouch, I have questioned whether or not the fistula is still there, did it need to be healed/dealt with before I had jpouch removed? And I assumed that was why I was leaking drainage vaginally- but maybe I don’t have one anymore, and like Liz said, I am leaking vaginally, because that’s the main way the drainage can come out. And I inquired about the fistula being healed/corrected before or during jpouch removal surgery because my other thought/concern is that if the fistula tract is contributing to the pelvic cavity not healing completely after jpouch removal, or…if its totally unrelated whether I have one or not.


So that is my story, all up to date- I have not been on jpouch group in awhile- since 2001, and used to be so connected to so many, and slowly lost touch during my hiatus of running on automatic phase (completely enjoyed life though! Just tired of surgeries and enjoyed life with my temp ostomy again- avoiding making decisions on all that for awhile!- until I had to).

So I am in decision mode and trying to plan for the summer, as it is an opportune time for surgery when you’re a teacher; But not sure if I want to go through with both procedures of having anus opened up and drain pelvic wound, and gracilis reconstruction. Or, just opening up and draining for now, leaving it open and seeing if any improvement comes with that. Everything I have learned and read regarding the gracilis procedure is that it is a long, painful, and arduous one, and I don’t know if I want to jump into that yet-or make a decision based on the opportunity of time that is coming up when school is out in 2 weeks.
My daughter had her ileostomy and j-pouch at Hopkins - a retired head of GI was called in (thank heavens) I hooked her up with the J-Pouch group out of CC years ago - and recently just came back from a seven hour (one way drive) for appointment. Doctor who diagnosed her cancer yesterday was a colo-rectal cancer in DC. SHe had been treated for infection and pain-killers to get lump to go down - - I told her I would pay for her to see the original surgeon who she keeps in touch with all the time. That is 19 hours away --I just wish she had asked the Doctor yesterday the questions she is asking me - how long is she going to live or even if it is terminal - I told her to write them down or enter them into her iPHONE - - -
So I am meeting with the colo-rectal surgeon tomorrow to meet with him again and ask him more questions that have developed over past few weeks after much researching and forming a definitive immediate plan for now. I will request to have an EUA to see if there is a fistula and he can open up and drain the pelvic wound and check it out.

Can't believe I've pushed through the past 6 weeks-just can't wait to get all this infection out of my body just to have more strength back and get rid of this pain/pressure.

Also, random but- has anyone had their anal sphincters removed? (Obviously if you have perm ostomy and don't need them)-colorectal rec taking those out, as they are in the way -does it feel odd not having that muscle there?
nat. I don't understand the details of how my backside parts were removed when my jpouch was ripped out. But I definitely still have "butt/anal" muscles. If I read the op report there are some big words in there like intersphincteric and anusectomy. I have no clue. But that doesn't feel strange. All that feels strange is the pressure from the unhealed wound.

Thinking you might want to ask how they intend to drain your wound. There are probably a few options: thru vagina, through the tiny opening left in the backside, CT guided drainage. Think you might want to ask about this and understand pros/cons. The early days of my wound and my early EUAs were drained through the vagina, as it was doing that on its own. But for about the last year, they have been opening it up in the backside at the end of the sinus tract where it keeps closing on its own.

Also you might want to ask about putting a drain in. Though it is a horrid, awful, not comfortable situation.. it may help your wound to heal. I had a mushroom catheter drain put in for several months last fall. I am sure you can read some of my posts on here at that time when I was in full $*tch mode. But it did help heal my wound a bit. The drain keeps the wound open so it can heal from inside to out (or top to down)

Also - you might want to ask about getting an infectious disease doctor involved, to culture whatever they can, to make sure that if there really is an infection that they are given you the correct antibiotic to fight that particular infection.

Wow - fun stuff to talk about on Saturday night!
Hey Liz,
Thanks so much for that extra info- good to know, and I will ask ask about his ideas for draining the wound. I have always been leaking from it (mainly from the vagina- as that is the path of least resistance), and a little from the tiny hole that is still left from backside.
I had assumed he would open up my anus (as it is sewn up) and then it would drain through there- never thought about it closing on its own if it were opened up.

And the drain sounds just awesomeWink......But thankful for the knowledge to be proactive about and ask about it-will go through whatever needed for healing. Smiler

And I do currently have my anal sphincters (muscles)- My old surgeon kept my anus/muscles in tact when he removed my jpouch and sewed me up. It doesn't feel weird to me at all- I don't even notice that I'm sewn up below with no a-hole. Thought I would before surgery, but I think keeping the muscles makes it feel more natural- I can still squeeze them and feel them-though it does hurt when I squeeze them- I can feel the rawness and pain in anal canal when I do.
But my plastic surgeon is the one who said my colo-rectal surgeon wants to take them out because they are just kind of in the way, and if he eventually goes in and cores everything out, he wanted to take the sphincers out too- and I just thougth, what would that feel like? Not having and feeling those muscles down there anymore-so weird. And not sure how I feel about them being gone.

But anyhoo, it was a side note at last Tues. appt with plastic surgeon and through me off, but wanted to throw it out there to others to see if anyone else has had theirs taken out and how does it feel?

Thank you again and I will add those points to my list of questions Monday! I asked the nurse for his last appt. as did make a point to say I would like to talk with him and discuss questions I had, so no being rushed out! Smiler
He's not the warmest guy!

And yes, I'm feeling like a rockstar as a single girl discussing my anal troubles in depth on a Sat. night.Wink
Right now, its my second job though!

Keep you posted!
Natalie,

Liz is an invaluable resource and I'm so glad to see that you've connected with her.

I don't have anything to add except to tell you the term my surgeon used with me. He told me he plans to preserve part of the muscle that provides blood supply to help with wound healing and provide a base for holding the stitches after he removes my j-pouch. He used the term "intersphincteric muscle." Sounds like that's what you had done.

You ARE a Rock Star! And don't you forget it! :-)

Best wishes and keep us posted.

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